TIR VS Position
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Posted by: lvw ®

01/30/2007, 13:24:58

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I have a part that is long and cylindrical. 3.500 od x approx 20 in. long. And a larger diameter at one end approx 12 in od and this is the datum -A-. The print calss for the smaller od to be position to -a- .016 (thousandths). Our engineering department is telling us to locate on -A- and indicate the smaller od not to exceed .016 TIR. My argument is this method is not checking position also we need to put it on the cmm to check position. (easiest way). Am I right?
It has been an ongoing problem at my company for a long time.
Is there a method to convert the TIR to position?
Thanks
Larry







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Re: TIR VS Position
Re: TIR VS Position -- lvw Post Reply Top of thread Forum
Posted by: Kelly Bramble ®

01/30/2007, 14:11:12

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For all practical purposes, TIR is measuring the position of the smaller cylinder relative to the larger datum cylinder or origin. Except, that the TIR (Total Indicator Reading) or Total Runnout is also controlling the cylindricity and straightness. So, if by TIR you realy mean Total Runnout, the tolerance is a little more aggresive or comprehensive than position tolerance used alone.

To me, your challenges are that manufacturing one end of the cylinder relative to the other datum end to .016 TIR over twenty inches may not be a reasonable tolerance.

Most modern CMM's should be able to measure Total Runnout. An advantage of Total Runnout is that this is simple to measure during an in-process inspection while manufacturing.

Another question that should be asked is if Total Runnout is realy required? If the larger diameter datum feature is actually rotating within the target assembly and all of the surface elements of the smaller diameter feature must meet the requirements of runout, than the specification is justified. Position is more of a surface boundary requirement relative to the specified datum.








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