Hydraulic Augmented Gearing system
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Re: Hydraulic Augmented Gearing system
Re: Hydraulic Augmented Gearing system -- ecotec	Post Reply	Top of thread	Forum

Posted by: kelly_bramble ® 11/25/2005, 18:45:27 Author Profile Mail author Edit

I think I am a bit confused about your statement "system allows up to 30% energy savings for the same amount of work". I'm not sure how one can add an mechanical attachment (device) between a drill motor and the driven object and gain efficiency. Conservation of energy laws suggest otherwise (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Conservation_of_energy). I can see an increase in torque or velocity, however this comes at an efficiency price. You might consider an independent analysis of your device, as well as testing before you spend $25K on a patent. Just get a standard signed non-disclosure aggreement from however does it. Good luck! Modified by kelly_bramble at Fri, Nov 25, 2005, 18:48:31

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Re: Hydraulic Augmented Gearing system
Re: Re: Hydraulic Augmented Gearing system -- kelly_bramble	Post Reply	Top of thread	Forum

Posted by: ecotec ® 11/25/2005, 18:54:37 Author Profile Mail author Edit

Hello Kelly_Bramble, The title of the thread suggest where such a conversion originates. The balance between efficiency and operation depends on the intended purpose amd the manner of the design to effect the purpose. Any system to my mind, which is applied to any work, is inherently innefficient yet, the work for the resources committed are usually more than sufficient to meet most end requirements. The same is true for this device. Edit* Have had several independent assessments, all agree to the feasibility of the mechanism. One assessor actually fell off his stool as he realised the implications of the part which made the system function, very funny it was. Modified by ecotec at Fri, Nov 25, 2005, 19:43:43

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Re: Hydraulic Augmented Gearing system
Re: Re: Hydraulic Augmented Gearing system -- ecotec	Post Reply	Top of thread	Forum

Posted by: Cragyon ® 11/27/2005, 12:20:31 Author Profile Mail author Edit

I agree, and it also evident that an isothermal hypo-logarithmic hydrostatic planetary gear coupled with a static oriented inductor with current limiting semi-conductors will conclusively adhere to the performance principles required.

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Re: Hydraulic Augmented Gearing system
Re: Re: Hydraulic Augmented Gearing system -- ecotec	Post Reply	Top of thread	Forum

Posted by: kelly_bramble ® 11/26/2005, 16:15:03 Author Profile Mail author Edit

Very interesting, however I am more confused. Your reply to me only obfuscates the function of your device. I think that if you sincerely are looking for application feasibility suggestions, you will need to be more explicit. Why don't you contrast performance specifications (input vs. output), for our review and recommendations? You might contrast your devices performance and function to a well-known mechanical system, component or application. You might also indicate the following; Weight Materials used in the construction Number of parts in an assembly By only revealing the performance specifications of your device, you will be protecting your concept.

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Re: Hydraulic Augmented Gearing system
Re: Re: Hydraulic Augmented Gearing system -- kelly_bramble	Post Reply	Top of thread	Forum

Posted by: ecotec ® 11/27/2005, 07:20:52 Author Profile Mail author Edit

Thanks for your interest however, I am not loking for "application feasibility suggestions" at all. I was simply asking a forum of engineers if a device as described would, in their opinion, be usefull to them. Choosing such a forum of course, would in my mind, present the question to the best possible source. As I have recived not one single reply to the question, I see no further point in pursuing this thread. Thank you all for your time.

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Re: Hydraulic Augmented Gearing system
Re: Re: Hydraulic Augmented Gearing system -- ecotec	Post Reply	Top of thread	Forum

Posted by: kelly_bramble ® 11/27/2005, 08:16:52 Author Profile Mail author Edit

Let me quote your original question "My question, Of all the engineers here, how much of a demand would such a device engender?" For the vast number of very experienced and knowledgeable engineers whom visit Engineers Edge to best estimate the demand for your device, the device specifications and performance would need to be understood. Specifications, for the most part, is what engineering and design is all about.. Modified by kelly_bramble at Sun, Nov 27, 2005, 08:17:37

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Re: Hydraulic Augmented Gearing system
Re: Hydraulic Augmented Gearing system -- ecotec	Post Reply	Top of thread	Forum

Posted by: Gary Kemp ® 11/25/2005, 00:22:41 Author Profile Mail author Edit

Have you patented this item yet? If so, I would like to see it. If not, you should contact a patent attorney and pursue the patent prior to disclosing it publicly. Once you have protected yourself, I would like to see it. There could be several applications in other fields for such an item. Gary Kemp

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Re: Hydraulic Augmented Gearing system
Re: Re: Hydraulic Augmented Gearing system -- Gary Kemp	Post Reply	Top of thread	Forum

Posted by: ecotec ® 11/25/2005, 01:47:40 Author Profile Mail author Edit

Hello Gary,Thanks for your interest. The idea went into a preliminary patenting phase many years ago and showed me the pure folly of subjecting an idea to patent measures before a commercial pipeline is established. I will initiate patenting again after the completion of a working prototype for the purpose proposed. That way, I ensure little actual information is lost before the requirements of a solid patent eventuates. The device comprises 3 componants which are in themselves improvements of their respective mechanisms and it is here where I will seek an actual real term patent at the same time as applying for one for a complete unit. There are many fields the device may be incorporated into but they can wait a while yet.

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Re: Hydraulic Augmented Gearing system
Re: Re: Hydraulic Augmented Gearing system -- ecotec	Post Reply	Top of thread	Forum

Posted by: Cragyon ® 11/27/2005, 12:38:09 Author Profile Mail author Edit

What do you mean by "the pure folly of subjecting an idea to patent measures before a commercial pipeline is established". Patents are issued (in the USA) on principle of operation/concept. If you have unique design and application, then a patent will protect your hard work. I would be, and have been, hard pressed to approach any commercial entity with a good product in hand without a patent in place to protect me. You will need to prove your product, protect, and then market. Keep in mind that, there are very few new ideas in mechanical design. Most innovations are in materials, processes and combinations of complex components and systems. Novelty items only require a patent and smart marketing.

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Re: Hydraulic Augmented Gearing system
Re: Re: Hydraulic Augmented Gearing system -- Cragyon	Post Reply	Top of thread	Forum

Posted by: ecotec ® 11/27/2005, 17:05:58 Author Profile Mail author Edit

You are right on the nose here. The device consists of redesigned componants only within an arangement to effect the end means. Nothing new anywhere except for the manner in which the principles of an hydraulic jack, a dispersion chamber and a take-off wheel have been arranged. Patenting would be a precarious proposition as any form of innovation on any of the componants that is commercially effective would challenge any patenting measure I had unless my design proved the most effective in both marketing and operational terms. Giving out such information in a patent process before an effective marketing pipeline was secured would hand to my competitors the means to superceede my design and consequently, wrest the patent off me for the componants that are critical to the operation of the device. A provisional would cover 12 months but after that, full measures would have to ensue. Modified by ecotec at Sun, Nov 27, 2005, 18:30:14

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Re: Hydraulic Augmented Gearing system
Re: Re: Hydraulic Augmented Gearing system -- ecotec	Post Reply	Top of thread	Forum

Posted by: Gary Kemp ® 11/25/2005, 02:03:44 Author Profile Mail author Edit

Sounds interesting. Whenever you reach the point of being able to disclose the mechanism I would like to see it. I sold the patent rights to an invention last year to a company who then sold out to another company and have started a new company. In addition they have set me up with a cad workstation and are investing in the patent costs for more inventions we are pursuing. We are always looking for new things to consider. So as I said, I would like to see your device once you are covered. Gary

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Re: Hydraulic Augmented Gearing system
Re: Re: Hydraulic Augmented Gearing system -- Gary Kemp	Post Reply	Top of thread	Forum

Posted by: ecotec ® 11/25/2005, 19:03:25 Author Profile Mail author Edit

-- Message removed -- Solicitations are not allowed within Engineers Edge Engineering forums. Read the rules. Related link: Posting Policy - Rules Modified by Administrator at Sat, Nov 26, 2005, 10:09:43

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Re: Hydraulic Augmented Gearing system
Re: Re: Hydraulic Augmented Gearing system -- ecotec	Post Reply	Top of thread	Forum

Posted by: Gary Kemp ® 11/28/2005, 11:47:33 Author Profile Mail author Edit

If it was disclosed 20 years ago in a published article then you would be barred statutorily from patenting it since you would have been required at that time to apply within a year of publication. Additionally, if no new technical matter or new elements have come into play, another statutory bar could be a claim of non-diligence in pursuit of the patent. You may still be able to obtain some coverage in a more restricted sense for a specific application if the original 20 year old invention did not "anticipate" the new use or the new "elements". The burden of demonstrating usefulness is really on the inventor. I think if you believe it is useful you should see a patent attorney to determine if you can salvage patent coverage. Then shop it around to companies who are in related businesses. Your best bet may be to manufacture it yourself rather than hope for someone else's approval or interest. The further you take it yourself the more valuable it becomes because success breeds interest and value. The vast majority of larger companies won't even talk to you if you don't already have a patent. Good luck on it, Gary Kemp

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Re: Hydraulic Augmented Gearing system
Re: Re: Hydraulic Augmented Gearing system -- ecotec	Post Reply	Top of thread	Forum

Posted by: ecotec ® 11/27/2005, 07:23:55 Author Profile Mail author Edit

My apologies Administrator, I had not thought out my response correctly and as this thread has not given a clear response to the original question posed, please feel free to delete or remove it. Thank you all for your time.

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Re: Hydraulic Augmented Gearing system
Re: Re: Hydraulic Augmented Gearing system -- ecotec	Post Reply	Top of thread	Forum

Posted by: randykimball ® 11/27/2005, 20:03:29 Author Profile Mail author Edit

The reason I have remained silent in this issue.... ??? I can't evaluate something I have no idea what is... .. nor can I make a recomemdation of how usefull or how likely I would want to use it is if I have no idea what it does. If indeed a patent is in some form of pending process the concept has a legal chronological record to the applicant... but I have read no articulation of any reasonable explanation of the device. I can not but wonder why the project was ever mentioned. The worst suggestion of your lifetime may be the catalyst to the grandest idea of the century, never let suggestions go unsaid nor fail to listen to them.

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